Fact or Fiction: Pontiac Trans Am Prototype

1969 Pontiac Trans Am Prototype

Thanks to Barn Finds reader Brett P., we have a mystery on our hands. Here on eBay is what’s purported to be a 1969 Pontiac Trans Am prototype, but not without a good deal of confusion and controversy as suggested by the seller. He goes on at lengths in an attempt to validate the car’s history, which will cost a pretty penny if you believe it to be true: the asking price is a cool $75,000.

Pontiac Trans Am Prototype

The litany of features that the seller claims validate his car as a 1 of 1 prototype is quite long. If I understand his story correctly, this black-and-white photo is the one shred of evidence as to the car’s as-new existence (meaning this isn’t a cobbled together replica). Upon contacting the owner of the photo, that individual then made a play for the car and tried to convince him (the eBay seller) that he did not own the real deal due to discrepancies in the quarter panel design.

1969 Pontiac Trans Am Engine

Everything, from the Cibie headlights to the seat foam to the dual-snorkel air cleaner are said to be features that were only found on this prototype Trans Am. Even the engine is considered rare, listed as a “pre-production 455 H.O.” mill that runs flawlessly, according to the seller. The listing disintegrates into tales of drag strip glory and his logic behind why the plugs used to foul up. Personally, my rule of thumb is that the longer it takes to explain something, the less likely I am to believe it’s true, but I’m a bit of a pessimist that way.

firebird4

Nothing is said about this license plate, but I can only assume it’s meant to indicate that this car wore manufacturer-issued tags at one time. I can’t find much on Google about this car, other than a reference to the first prototype built in 1969 via MuscleCarFilms.com. However, the picture it shows of a Trans Am prototype doesn’t align with this example, most notably due to the eBay car’s lack of brake cooling ducts and the recessed hood scoops. I’m not sure where to go with this one, so let’s have our GM/Pontiac experts weigh in on the validity of this reputed prototype.

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Comments

  1. George

    Hmm, all expert on the car but thinks it should run fine on 87 octane?

  2. dj

    Since Trans Am cars were built for racing, I call bull sh$% on this one. It has air conditioning. Dual Snork air cleaner is not Pontiac either. Looks to be one off a 78 Corvette

  3. RayT Member

    Sort of a screwy listing. Guess I can’t blame the seller for pouring on a thick coat of hype, but it seems a little “off.” I don’t know how helpful GM would be with questions about the car, but if I owned it — or was thinking about buying it — they’d be my first stop.

    What I DO know something about is “MFG” plates. I’ve driven hundreds and hundreds of cars so fitted; they are issued to the manufacturers (each with a distinctive “main” number: in CA, GM was “015,” Ford “014,” Chrysler “4,” etc.) and not for a particular car. That same plate could have been on a Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick or Oldsmobile the day before it went in the ‘Bird’s trunk. Some plates went on press-fleet loaners, others on prototypes, company cars or loaners. The plate, in short, is irrelevant to the story.

    • Franke Paige

      He’s a lot off, off his meds…..

  4. DENIS

    pffhhhhhhh…..

  5. hhaleblian

    Ah lookee here pardners, I’ve got this bridge…….

  6. DanaPointJohn

    Wow, what a rambling mess of creative writing attempting to describe a car that, without unquestionable verification and documentation, probably few people really care much about.

  7. Jim

    Nothing like a fuzzy photo of a car you are trying to sell for $75k.

  8. Franke Paige

    I’ve seen this car up for sale for several years now, the seller says his car is a prototype, but lacks any proof. He has long explanations about parts on his car, parts you can put on, not factory parts. He’s had it up for sale for as much as $250,000, as low as $50,000. I saw he tried to auction the car, mecum’s? What happened? Who knows , but for as much as he wants he has nothing, nothing but explanations and stories, not something I’d pay $75,000 for. There are prototypes out there, people have them, they also have paperwork, proof that it is what it is. This guy is pretty persistent , his car keeps popping up on different websites, even over in Europe. If I had money, money like he wants for this car, I’d be doing a lot of research, spending some money to make sure it is what he claims.

  9. Jim

    I stand corrected he was looking for $200k back in 20014, I guess the classic auction route didn’t go too well.
    https://www.facebook.com/pontiactestcartransamprototype/?fref=photo

  10. dave

    If factory prototype (GM) i believe it would have a MI manufacturers plate. The plate would look like this.

    • RayT Member

      Dave, It could as easily have a CA manufacturer’s plate. I saw several prototypes with the CA plates; they moved around a lot, and so did the plates. But, as I said, the plates themselves mean nothing. The manufacturers ditched the CA black plates decades ago.

  11. Jason Houston

    Hoooey! Where do I begin?

    The seller starts out with an ominous name (“toobadyoucan’tseeme” or some s**t), has ZERO feedback, and cannot read, write, spell or construct a meaningful sentence or paragraph. He thinks he knows what he’s saying, but he’s the only one who does.

    He badmouths everyone who has come to see his car, and waxes poetically about all the scams, rip-offs, etc. he can think of. As Shakespeare said, “Me thinks the lady doth protesteth too much.”

    Manteca is a tiny farming town in the Great Central Valley of California, which is hardly a hotbed of car activity. I’m not an expert on Firebirds by any means, but Fremont was a GM assembly plant, not a design studio. (It was leased to Toyota in the 1980s, who still runs it today.)

    He places a lot of stock in the foam and upholstery, but in little else.

    Is this guy full of it?

    How big a crock can you locate to hold it all?

    • dave

      Manteca is in my back yard. I can check this car out with a Pontiac expert that lives in Redford MI. He worked with Kieth Wilson of Wilson Pontiac in Royal Oak MI back in the day. He knows these Ponchos inside out.

      Like 1
      • randy

        Please fill us in the real scoop.

      • California Gary

        I worked in the Foundry at Pontiac Motor when this car was built. We identified all of our experimental or pre production castings with a letter “X” scratched in the mold. Check on the block or heads for this mark.

        Like 2
    • Woodie Man

      Manteca is also a prison town. Maybe the “seller” is in the pen.

  12. JohnD

    Well, I don’t know! It isn’t every day you can buy a Firebird with SPECIAL seat foam!!!! Oh, wait, apparently it is. . .. Sad that he has a car with SPECIAL seat foam and is still so angry . . .Maybe it is something in the foam . . ..

  13. Greg

    I’ve owned a couple of experimental Pontiac’s and prototype cars from the 80’s. They typically have experimental tags or other markings. Production date based off VIN should also be in indication.

    Jim Mattison of Pontiac Historical Services should be able to shed some light on this. I’m sure he knows the story and if he can’t provide providence then no one probably can.

    • Barzini

      The absence of any PHS documentation may be telling. Most sellers of older Pontiacs will include copies of the PHS documents in the ad to assure buyers it’s the real thing.

      • Franke Paige

        He has one, it comes back as a 350 car, he said it proves what he’s saying, that the engine was swapped for this “prototype”.

  14. randy

    I second the long winded zero feed back red flags. The more folks talk, the deeper the hole they tend to dig for themselves.

  15. dave

    Just went to read his Ebay ad. No 69 Pontiac with street tires is going to turn 12.22 from a guy that has never? drag raced. Maybe 14s on a good day.

    • Tom Member

      You forget, this one is special, 1 of 1. Or is it 1 of none? I forget.

  16. Dave

    I’d sooner have a nice restored ’69 with a 4 spd that you could probably pick up for 25k and enjoy and not be afraid to bring out on the street. These one off prototypes are for rich guys, if this car is even what it is claimed to be

  17. JW

    I have a serious headache after reading that load of garbage. If he really wanted to end the arguments with buyers all he would have to do is have PHS document it’s history.

    • Franke Paige

      True, but he would have some conspiracy theory about that too.

  18. Jim

    I call bovine excrement. Fremont was an A body assemble line in the 60’s. They never built a single F body there. It might have come from Van Nuys but not Fremont.

    To many questions and it doesn’t even LOOK like a 69 Trans Am.

    Nice try (not really)

  19. Franke Paige

    Any lawyers on here? Would this be considered fraud? A felony?

    • Dolphin Member

      I’m not a lawyer, but I believe there is no law against making claims about what you believe about something, like a car. That is simply free speech. If nobody buys the car, there is no fraud.

      I think what would constitute fraud would be making untrue claims in order to make a financial gain—-selling a car for more than its market value based on made up stories or unsubstantiated claims that inflate the car’s market value.

      That kind of fraud should be actionable in a court of law, but as lawyer John Draneas, who writes a column called ‘Legal Files’ in Sports Car Market magazine has said many times, someone can pursue and win a case of fraud after buying a misrepresented car, but often the only people who win are the lawyers.

      Better to investigate and confirm important claims before buying the car.

  20. Bobsmyuncle

    It’s actually all sort of sad.

    Even if the car is real, the guy clearly has some mental issues and no one will ever believe him. His spelling, writing style, use of multiple fonts, in multiple colours and sizes, the rhetoric, the rambling, the paranoia, all translates to a ‘no sale’.

    If anything he needs someone to represent him.

  21. Tom Member

    Here is my 2 cents. I am very knowledgeable when it comes to 67-69 Firebirds, but not necessarily Trans Am’s which are a different bird. If this was a proto type experimental, it should be easy for PHS to confirm especially if 1 of 1. Second, if I read correctly, 455 H. O. in 69, in a Trans Am prototype? There were 897 Trans Ams built in 69, 8 of which were convertibles. “Trans Am” was build to compete in that racing series, which if I am correct had a limit or max of 305 cubic inches. Firebird Trans Am’s built for the series, which is what the TA prototype WAS should have had a 303 in it. Pretty sure the 897 Trans Am’s produced had either a 400 (NOTHING LARGER) or a 303. Furthermore, Trans Am prototypes started with the 68 GEN 1 Firebird Body. I am sure there were 69 Body Prototypes for sure as that was the body that the car ended up in. Last, if this is a 1 of 1 prototype, I am pretty sure his price is off by a zero or maybe even a 7th pre-decimal digit. Not sure about a TA having AC? In theory they were built for racing but I am sure all 897 were not built to be factory racers. That is just my opinion and my thoughts.

    Like 1
    • Franke Paige

      What you say about the engines is true, but not for the Pontiac Trans Ams, they weren’t made to be in the trans am races, just have the name.

      • Tom Member

        Ok, like I mentioned, I am not a expert on Trans Am’s per say….I assumed Pontiac built the car for the Trans Am Circuit due to Chevy building the Z28 for that very purpose with a 302 and the “Z28” suspension package for that type of racing. I just assumed they developed a “trans am” for Trans Am racing. My bad.

  22. Bobsmyuncle

    FWIW I don’t know what BF is talking about regarding brake ducts. Are you guys somehow thinking the front air dam on the ‘original’ is a brake duct? Similarly the hood ducts on the ‘original’ aren’t recessed, at least not in the way I understand the description.

  23. Franke Paige
  24. Luke Fitzgerald

    Boys – you weren’t joking about the write up – whoa!

  25. Dolphin Member

    What you want is a no-stories car. This car has endless stories.

    I think Greg’s suggestion about contacting Pontiac Historical Services for information on the car is spot-on. If the seller was up to much he would already have done that.

  26. methodjason Member

    For what it’s worth, here are the auction details of a VERIFIED 1969 Trans Am prototype:

    http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Archive/Event/Item/1969-PONTIAC-FIREBIRD-TRANS-AM-2-DOOR-HARDTOP-180191

    As for the orange car, reading the link on musclecarfilms.com is interesting and makes a hell of a lot more sense than the seller’s auction description. Engineering prototype #9723 (A Firebird, NOT a Trans Am by the way) did indeed use a 455 and was painted in the same Carousel Red color. Who knows if his car is the same one, given the lack of actual documentation and decent photos. But at least the story makes more sense!

    http://musclecarfilms.com/1969_Firebird_Engineering_Cars_4.html

  27. piper62j

    Yo!! No documentation,,, No $$$$$

  28. Tom Member

    Once again, all of these references to the uniqueness of the quarter panels, seats and other items but ZERO decent photos, much less close-up, of any of them. I have rebuilt 2 – 69 Firebirds. If the quarter panel on the prototype was different, I would like to know how again it was different with a picture that shows it to me. No decent pictures of these factory options, no decent interior shots.

  29. Franke Paige

    Being that he makes all these claims about the car could make this a good case for a fraud investigation from the local district attorney. If he had just posted it and not made all these claims….

    • dave

      Wouldn’t hold up until the car is bought. Crime not commented until then.Then you would have to hire professional witnesses and with that, no attorney is going to touch this because it would cost thousands of dollars.

      • Franke Paige

        I was looking at how much effort he was putting into proving it was real, it’s unusually high, this is for personal financial gain, there is no proof, well, there is proof that it’s only a 350 car, a phs document he has. I see this is no different than someone taking a car and cloning it, using, adding distressed parts to make it something it’s not, which he is, it’s clearly fraud. If he had just posted it for sale, made no claims it would be different.

      • Woodie Man

        “Committed” you mean. The fraud would be in the misrepresentation of the provenance of the car IF the seller INDUCED the buyer to buy using the misrepresentation and the buyer RELIED on the sellers misrepresentations.More or less. Not a crime but a civil tort.

  30. John

    It can’t be the prototype because we used it to put Hoffa in. It’s under the 3rd base line in Cleveland.

  31. MountainMan

    Finally checked out the sellers ad. I was thinking the car could be something one off then checked out the eBay ad. Wow…maybe no

  32. rdc

    This is the 1969 Trans-Am Prototype that sold at Barrett-Jackson.

    http://www.lex18.com/clip/11054344/lexington-man-restores-rare-classic-car

  33. Steve

    All aboard the Crazy train!

  34. 64 bonneville

    seller says it has factory air conditioning, however, the compressor and brackets, and part of the lines are missing. Look to the left rear of the firewall where the A/C lines and unit are mounted. BTW the Trans Am series was limited to 305 cubic inches. Pontiac ran a 301 cubic inch engine in the ones “factory” sponsored.

    • John Heeg

      The only Pontiac Firbird I remember being run in the Trans-Am series I think was run around 1970 by Herb Adams and he told SCCA officials it was a Canadian car that was available with the Chevy 302 engine. The SCCA eventually caught on. I do remember reading that even though Herb worked for Pontiac at the time Pontiac had no funding involved.

      Like 1
    • Tom Member

      True in that the compressor is not there but 1 of the 2 “plates” I will call them, for lack of the proper name, is present if you look on the photo with the hood open, on the left there is a plate on the left front (car right side) that is over the top radiator support to the front bumper structure. The other side (car left side/driver) is missing. These plates were only on cars that had AC. If we could have a decent shot of the interior, the vent in the top center of the dash would be the other clue to factory AC. No vent, no factory AC unless the dash has been changed out.

  35. Car Guy

    I remember a business mentor of mine once saying, “Trust but verify” in other words believe 1/2 ( or less) of what you hear and only what you can verify. I read the ad, and I would say this guy, may truly believe he has a true prototype( but with his rambling writing style, I would venture a guess somehow chemicals were involved) , but before I lay any cash, I would make dam sure I did my homework.
    I want to believe, really i do!

    • grant

      I think that was Reagan.

  36. Texas Tea

    Horse feathers…………………….., And that’s being nice.

  37. Rspcharger Rspcharger

    Well, we at least know he’s proficient at changing font size & color. Jeez dude, chill the F out and make it readable.

  38. Mark S Member

    In the immortal words of kernel Sherman Potter (of MASH fame) HORSE HOCKEY!!!!!

  39. Marty Member

    Quite the narrative. Long on story and short on details. Nice of the guy to grant us permission to do the research for him…he certainly hasn’t done much of it.
    Or at least it doesn’t look like he retained the actual documentation, and has skipped a few of the most important pieces. But hey, you’re free to look it all up yourself on Google if you don’t believe him. He should know that five and six figure prototype cars aren’t documented with Google search results. Rather than have anything printed and ready from the California DMV, you can just ride up there with him and verify the plate, you know, if you’re not doing anything else…

    The PHS letter would be a logical place to start, but the seller seems to imply that this car was modified by GM after it was produced, and therefore, the tag numbers aren’t going to really reveal anything about it. I guess GM felt no reason at the time to document anything they were doing to this particular car. Maybe it was “off the books”. Sure, the numbers may say it’s a 350 car, but that’s before they installed the “pre-production 455”. If all that were true, it would be difficult to prove much about it by looking up a bunch of part numbers. It looks like a ridiculous effort to try and sell a car with a seventy five thousand dollar price tag using this kind of story, but at least it’s matched well with the weak description and equally inadequate photos.

    On the long shot that this car actually would turn out to be something rare, this is an absolute fail at presenting it.

    I don’t think this is a deliberate attempt at fraud. I think the seller actually believes the story. He might be the only one that does.

    • rdc

      Yep, great video about Curt’s Trans Am.

  40. scott m

    It sounds like a childhood story i told about a 427 nova supposedly it was a factory test car everything was taking care of by the dealership and everything documented so there should be a paper trail somewhere if it is the real deal

  41. OhU8one2

    This car is a “Mule” in the automotive world. What that is a car that is used as R&D. It is basically a factory body in white,that the engineering dept put’s part’s on and removes to check fit,finish,durability,fading etc…….. One minute it’s running a big motor, next week it’s an inline 6 cyl. There are a lot of outside venders or suppliers for any car maker,and you wouldn’t want that part failing quickly,cause why? Because it reflects back onto Pontiac,then onto Firebird’s. The public will get the inside scoop that the Firebird is a pile of @&$). Almost same thing with Corvair. As far as the mule goes, I’m amazed it didn’t get crushed. Like it should have been. Even the preproduction cars are crushed.Why? Because certain element’s are either removed for a lot of reason’s,or they make the grade and remain for production. Jim Wangers would know the skinny on this ol Indian. He was in charge of marketing and for sure would have been in the loop. So good luck with the MULE!

    • Bobsmyuncle

      So this is the seller???

  42. Dan h

    Bottom line is, without proper documentation and an expert inspection, car will never be a valid prototype.

  43. brakeservo

    You guys want some fun?? Just send the seller a message through eBay and politely suggest that it appears English is not his first language and perhaps he should have a friend or associate who understands spelling, grammar and punctuation re-write his listing for him. Then see if you get a vile, profanity filled insane rant back like I did! I’m forwarding it on to eBay.

    Like 1
  44. Tyler

    Mule car, possibly. Also could have been a one off executive car like Pete Estes’s 68 Camaro convertible with a Z/28 package. Or maybe even a COPO car. Maybe even a dealer prepped car for a buyer willing to shell out the money. Who knows for sure. But it should be easy enough to verify with a VIN & title search. Locate previous owners, maybe the dealership that sold it is still in business & has the records. It does appear the seller is hostile towards anyone who questions his prototype theory. A legit seller would welcome any & all additional information concerning the authenticity of a rare automobile.

    • Adam Rock

      It’s a brown 1969 Firebird 350 2-bbl. People have posted his PHS many times before. There’s nothing unusual about it, and it’s been vetted dozens of times over the past 4 years. The seller is Jeremy Wil from Manteca CA. He has some issues, least of which was his Facebook page he recently took down where he showed his bags of pot, and this one, showing rolls of cash strewn over the hood of the Firebird.

      Like 1
  45. Larry M

    WOW is right. One of the better comment generating postings. Where do you begin?
    First of all, me being 57 yrs old, I’ve seen this type of rationale before, usually pre-admittance. this guy needs a time out. Maybe 3-5 for “evaluation”. I’m not trying to be mean, but hell. chicken little said that foxy loxy said that r&d, undocumented, said. He either needs to go away, get it together; documentation and all, or insure it heavily and hope for a heavy snow storm on the roof of his garage this winter. good luck. i’m usually the easiest to convince in my group, but not so sure this time.

  46. Tyler

    This car is mentioned at the bottom of this page: http://musclecarfilms.com/1969_Firebird_Engineering_Cars_4.html

  47. Adam Rock

    Guys, PLEASE don’t promote this crap. You’re too intelligent to fall for a scammer. This guy is Jeremy Wil, he’s out of Manteca CA, and has been trying to con someone into buying this load of garbage for years now. He captured photos off the web, then roller painted his car to look like the one in the photo. He’s been booted off every Pontiac forum, has 20 aliases, and every time he tries to sell his car, people whack away at his craziness and all his lies. He then uses information people post to twist his story further, which is why it’s so confusing and convoluted. His car is a brown 1969 Firebird 350 2bbl. There’s absolutely NOTHING special about it. Please don’t get duped and give the guy more exposure.

    Like 1
  48. John

    So Tyler, is the car in the posting car #9753?

    This gets curioser and curiouser.

  49. Chris

    I had dinner with Jim Mattison at Gibsons across from the Stephens Convention Center Friday night a few weeks ago when we were out there for the MCACN show. This car, among others came up on the conversation that evening and his comment was that there was not a single shred of evidence that Pontiac or General Motors has to the legitimacy of this car and the owner’s claims other than the PHS that this was a Brown 350 equipped 69 Firebird.

    Using the block code, casting numbers and partial VIN stamp provided in his own description, the engine is a 1968 400 originally installed in a Freemont built A-Body (GTO or LeMans). It is NOT a pre-production, experimental or development anything.

    It appears as though the owner has tried to establish a digital footprint supporting the legitimacy of his claims through various boards and has done so here as well – see the post above from OhU8one2 posted Dec 8, 2015 at 11:50pm where he tries to substantiate the car as a mule. This is a deliberate ruse and is not only tiresome but insulting to legitimate collectors.

  50. Adam Rock

    Jeremy Wil started this whole charade when he read a story on MusclecarFilms.com about the 1969 Trans Am prototype. He’s completely confused. He’s combined the features of three separate cars, a Trans Am prototype (Palladium Silver), a Styling Studio car (destroyed), and an Engineering Car #9723. He’s cobbled up all three stories and rolled them into one. The fact is that he has a brown 1969 Firebird 350 2bbl. PHS was notified long ago (give Jim Mattison at PHS a call, and hear what he has to say about this guy), and many people have seen the invoice for Jeremy’s car. Because he’s been vetted so many times, Jeremy now says he has a “re-invoiced” car (??) to confuse people. Just for the record, the car has a 1968 Pontiac 400 engine, nothing special. There’s no such thing as a prototype 455 H.O. His air cleaner is from a late 1970’s Chevrolet, his steering wheel is a beat up aftermarket unit, his “mysterious” seats are regular 1969 Firebird seats that someone reupholstered and covered the headrests. He’s trying to litter the web with stories (like this one, so apparently he’s succeeding) to create confusion in hope that someone will fly in and buy his $4,500 base model 1969 Firebird 350 2bbl for his asking price of $75,000, and ask questions later.

    • rdc

      If someone buys it for $75,000. They will be in court later suing the seller, I am sure.

    • Bobsmyuncle

      Adam if you can post some links to the history of this scam I’m going to take it upon myself to contact his local police department.

      I’ve saw something similar occur years ago and there WAS legal action taken prior to any actual fraud being committed.

      • Adam Rock

        Bob, links have been posted, awaiting moderator approval. There are so many threads about this guy (and car) over the past 4 years, it’s hard to keep track. E-Bay doesn’t care, they enjoy the fact that websites (like this one) post links and draw attention, because E-Bay gets more clicks, more browsers, more shoppers. If you want another laugh, look on E-Bay and you’ll see a Porsche 911 “prototype” for $21,000,000. We call this guy “Jeremy’s brother”. He’s another conspiracy theorist that needs help.

      • Bobsmyuncle

        Thanks Adam.

        Hey it won’t be any real effort so why not? I’m going to follow up for sure.

  51. Bobsmyuncle

    Well. That’s that. Is there a way to flag eBay postings? If so we should all do so.

  52. Tyler

    The truth explains why it has not been to one of the major auctions! This guy is a black mark on the entire car culture. It’s good that he is being exposed.

  53. Adam Rock

    Dozens and dozens of threads about Jeremy going back to 2011. He tried to put his car through Mecum Auctions (no photos of course, just a vivid description), but Pontiac people alerted Dana Mecum. The auction house forced Jeremy to change his ad, and when he did, it read like the used brown 1969 Firebird 350 2-bbl car it truly was. Of course, Jeremy used this moment to say “My car went through Mecum!” to further his scam. Mecum was laughing all the way to the bank as they collected his entry fee, which was a substantial amount.

    By the way, his other tactic is to disguise himself and join in the conversation, acting like an interested 3rd party (look at the post above under his alias OhU8one2). He’s as transparent as a jelly fish on a sunny day.

    His other tactic, when he’s discovered, is to use foul language and profanity within a thread, and then moderators delete the entire thread. That’s his plan, to cover his tracks. But he’s been tracked for 4 years, and all the threads and attempts to sell his scam story have been logged.

    He’s poisoned the Ford forums, Chevy forums, and especially the Pontiac forums.

    http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758555
    http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=783533
    http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=366193
    http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=758555
    http://firstgenfirebird.org/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=285650&page=1

    He’s put the car through E-Bay under 3 different E-Bay names. They keep shutting his account down. He’s the very definition of a pathological liar. Whenever facts are presented, he comes up with another wild story to justify his theory. That’s why the E-Bay ad is so weird. It’s the culmination of 4 years of constantly revamping his story.

    • JW

      This guy sounds very dangerous to me, I wouldn’t even attempt to look at the car or meet this guy in person without my .380.

  54. Matt D

    This clown has YouTube video too!

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UQQoEGOZXA4

  55. Adam Rock

    By the way, when he tried to run the car through Mecum Auctions, Monterey 2014, his description originally read like his wild E-Bay ad, without all the extra stuff about drag racing. When Dana Mecum was alerted, they told Jeremy he had to provide only factual information that could be verified by their research team. Not surprisingly, his Mecum ad changed to read like a used car ad. Of course, Jeremy was a no-show with the car. Here’s what his ad looked!

    https://www.mecum.com/lot-detail/CA0814-190527/0/1969-Pontiac-Firebird/

  56. Little_Cars Alexander Member

    I’m with you, John. The car at the bottom of that link is a pretty good match to the car posted for sale. But even if I had $75k lying around I wouldn’t drive five miles to buy this gentleman’s car judging by the lack of “provenance” to back up his claims.

  57. randy

    Hey Bob, burn this ass hat, I bet you could get a collection going here to help you along.

  58. Jeff Staff

    And I thought my wife was mean in the morning!

  59. PaulG

    My head hurts from reading his eBay ad.
    Unfortunate circumstances force the sale.
    No further comment…

  60. Bobsmyuncle

    Barn Finds how could you remove my post with his response?! If THAT doesn’t prove this guy’s credibility NOTHING does.

  61. Rocco

    I think this car was a test mule for the ’70-up trans am cars. He said it was produced around July ’69. The factories use old cars for testing the drive line of future cars. They try out different components for the up coming yrs., hence the MFG plate.
    It might be a unique car, but not $75K unique.

    Just my $.02

  62. Adam Rock

    Jeremy Wil (Rocco above) once again trying to add mystery to his scam. Your car has a 1968 Pontiac 400. How did the “factory” test a 1969 model with 1968 engine? You have a brown 1969 Firebird 350 2-bbl. There’s nothing special about it. You don’t have a unique car. It’s worth about $3500. Jim Mattison from PHS has your invoice.

  63. Al

    By the way, the inner holes on the Ferari steering wheel do not align up the same as the Pontiac wheel, by a long stretch.

  64. John

    Hmmmm. Well he sure gets the Barnfolk riled up anyway. Hopefully he will crawl back under his rock.

    I’d still like to find a Bugeye that I can afford.

    • Jesse Mortensen Jesse Staff

      I’d like to find an affordable Bugeye too John!

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