More than once I have lamented the tendency of GM’s 1964-1972 vintage A-body intermediates to turn into “from whence it came”, via rust. The right climatic condition and you can have a pile of cinders on your hands. Convertibles? My experience with them reveals an even greater proclivity to corrode thanks to either the rear fitment of the folding top or leaving it down at the wrong weather moment. So, with those thoughts in mind, let’s review this 1967 Pontiac GTO convertible. It’s located in Pompton Lakes, New Jersey and is available, here on craigslist for $7,500. Thanks to Gunter K for this tip!
A recent commenter stated that all cars of this era, given the proper conditions, rusted. And that appears to be an accurate statement. Some seemed to have more of that inclination than others, but it was pretty much a universal problem. Assuming that this goat has been a New Jersey resident for some length of time, its current condition is understood as winter weather and road salt are no strangers to the Garden State. This GTO will need a lot of metalwork!
Right off the bat, a new frame is needed and one is included in the sale. The seller will reduce the price to $6,000 if a purchaser doesn’t want the replacement frame. He also states, “needs complete restoration I have multiple OPGI sheet metal parts for this car which I will sell separately for a deep discount“. The images pretty well do the talkin’, the exterior is in overall rough shape. The seller further adds, “Front Clip, hood, and driver’s side door from a 66 (easily converted to 1967 configuration)“. I’m not certain what conversion would need to occur or how “easily” that conversion can be facilitated. Fortunately, the convertible top frame appears to be present and intact.
The interior may best represent potential A-body ravages, the floor pan, as well as the trunk for that matter, have become swiss cheesed. It’s unfortunate but not uncommon. The original back seat is included but the fronts (no image) have been replaced with later model GM intermediate pieces. The instrument panel is looking shaky, the gauges are obscured with dust and the radio, heater controls, and glovebox lid are missing. It’s a safe bet that the wiring harness(es) will need to be replaced.
The big thing with the GTO was the “go”, which in ’67 meant a 335 gross HP, 400 CI V8, a new, standard equipment engine for the ’67 model year. This one’s a no-go as there is no engine or transmission. The cutout in the floor makes one think that this was a four-speed manual transmission-equipped car (there are no pedals visible other than the parking brake) but there is no specific reference listed. The seller mentions a 3.83 final drive ratio but that one doesn’t ring a bell as I believe the standard gear set was a 3.55 ratio with 3.23 or 3.90 also on the options list – whatever the case, it’s a small matter considering the lack of an engine and transmission.
A ’67 Pontiac GTO convertible is a blue-chip muscle car. This example, unfortunately, is chipped at best. Its deleterious condition, the cost of the extra sheet metal, the need for a frame swap, the hours and hours of required labor, as well as tracking down a suitable powertrain will likely make this Poncho one to pass. I’d like to see this GTO saved, but…what do you suggest, salvageable?
So, cut the crap and sell the body for $1500 if you can find a sucker for that, then advertise the frame for 6K and see if that will sell. This ain’t anything special.
OH, I mis-read the listing. Let me correct myself….
Cut the crap and sell the frame for $1500, and just crush the body and stop pretending it’s worth actual money.
Off to the scrap yard and keep the sellable pieces.
The car is restorable, but the price is outrageous IMHO. And the parts find to completion will be a challenge to say the least.
I like the car, and would never crush it like the idiots above suggest as know-it-alls.
One never crushes old tin like this no matter what condition. Never, ever crush tin like this.
Tin worms or not.
Bob
Put your money where your mouth is and give the guy 7500 for the thing.
First off, I live in CANUCKISTAN. Second, I’m always broke and don’t have a shop/garage. Third, my bank account is always running on empty, and if I had $7500.00 U$D I’d likely buy a used car because my 1996 Monte Carlo is getting old and cranky like moi.
Running a classic muscle car from the 60s is not fiscally responsible and I was raised by a Chartered Accountant so I have to be fiscally prudent and responsible at all times.
Bob
If you tried to load it onto the trailer I bet it would break in half with a sickening dusty crack.
Robert, I do agree with you! Never, ever crush old metal, when salvage is possible, with these era cars. People who make those suggestions are not car purists, they just look what profit they can turn, in and out quickly, move on to the next victim, they are the bottom feeders at best!
Looks like someone got in over their head! A convertible with rusted out floors. Looks like this is a job for a professional. Do you think the the GTO is caving in? Its a jack up the radiator cap vehicle and put a new car under it.
Frank, I have put numerous floors, quarter panels, frames under these cars. Currently completed a 68 Chevelle SS 138 car with new floors, braces, etc., for many people this may be a big under taking, and I do understand! For me it is just a normal transformation of a 50 year old RARE muscle car, that In this specific case needs to be salvaged. NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE SCRAP HEAP!
I totally agree with you here, Danny. This car is an excellent candidate for restoration with new trunk pan and new driver and passenger floor pans too. It’s standard fare for new floor pans and new trunk pans, but those who don’t do restoration work don’t understand the whole process from start-to-finish.
Once one has done a restoration it becomes obvious how to do things as you and I both know. The commenters that think this is junk don’t know restoration work at all, I agree.
One at least needs to be an actual welder that owns a MIG or TIG before the metal work becomes an easy task even though it looks daunting. We know this and yet the cheap seats on BF don’t yet.
Practice makes perfect I always say, And to be completely frank here there is no better place to learn how to weld with a MIG than a floor or trunk area in need of some welding.
Cheers, Bob
If everyone is out to save the world. Lets assume one can do it. What will you actually have? A former GTO in name only> Lets look deeper.
A former junk yard refugee that was parted down left for dead years ago. Wow comes with a new frame. OK new as in what? A brand new reproduction frame? No way. It’s only newly painted with another vin stamped into it. Original motor long vacated and we are also guessing it was a 4 speed. Shame. Get a PHS doc you don’t know if it’s a real goat after all.
When said and done you have a ghost of a former car built with a bunch of Chinese aftermarket parts, non original frame and drivetrain.
There is a reason guys. In this economy and fuel almost $4.00 a gallon shipping delays and the jacked up prices on everything. Anyone jumping into a full blown restoration would be very unwise. Think about it. Because someone can throw piles of money to make it all better doesn’t make sense. Which as it seems those that don’t have it cry the loudest.
Danny you are not the norm. You have what most people don’t have. Most people do not have the knowledge, correct equipment, time, spare money and place for projects like this. If you own a body shop or professional with spare time and light on collision work and a paid labor force great. I know what is involved I worked part-time for a friend in Massachusetts that did high end restorations on Gullwings, 356 Porsches sports cars, Hot Rods and Dragsters. His advice fine one that’s close to done because you will pay the same plus more to restore the rusty one. If you know shop rates and materials at customer cost you will agree.
$2750 for a new chassis. So the car that needs everything is $4750.00? Wow.
http://www.garys-classics.net/67gtskandchc.html
Even an accountants kid knows a completed car will be cheaper than buying one that needs absolutely everything.
I always love reading the comments on here from people who are not car enthusiasts and have no idea about what it takes to restore a car. My son owns a body shop and loves sixties cars as that’s what he dreamed about (other than girls) when he was a teenager. He currently owns a 69 Camaro and a 65 GTO. If he wanted a 67 GTO convertible and this one was reasonably priced he could rebuild it for less than what it would be worth when completed. I hate to see someone say to crush a car like this, especially a convertible.
Russ I commend your son for owning a business and saving old cars.No doubt he could save this. I would bet like others who own their business time is a big factor. Especially when repairing customer cars to put bread on the table. In a perfect world If we all had time to work on our stuff and that was all. No family No social events everyone would have dozens of cars and live like Jay Leno
$7500 for this? It will cost you $40k to restore it and you can buy a nice one for that
Russ, you say your son has a body shop. How about you? What have you restored? I’ve done at least three myself.
Being a car guy that is a restoration enthusiast, I know exactly what’s involved. This one is not worth it.
https://www.hotrodders.com/threads/1941-chrysler-new-yorker-hot-rod.522351/
https://www.chevelles.com/threads/69-el-camino-quickie-paint-job.1134235/
I see we have people who have been down this road personally or professionally. Its time and money. What its worth completed?
People that think this is easy are watching 30 minute car shows on television. If this was a rare Daytona winged Hemi model, 60’s Mustang GT350 or low production model anything I would understand but a GTO convertible is not rare.
Pugsy, I’m glad you asked. I’m 80 now and won’t be restoring any more vehicles as I have a 96 Chevy Z71 that looks like it belongs in the showroom. It will probably be my last vehicle. I’ve always been a car guy and “fixed up” many of the cars I’ve owned, so that they were better looking when I sold them than when I got them. When I finally got an inside place to work I did a body-off on a 47 Ford pickup, and got interested in trucks. Then I did a body off on a 53 Ford pickup. When my son was 15 I bought him a 69 Road Runner that was a theft recovery that we had to rebuild. Then we had several VW’s that we modified in looks and performance. Then when my youngest son was 16 I restored a 69 Chevy CST truck for him. Then I had a black 65 Ford truck that was very nice, then a blue 75 Ford that I built a 390 engine for, and then a tan 69 Dodge that I converted to 4X4. When I sold the Dodge I bought a 56 Chevy truck and restored it. My son converted it to a big back window for me. I sold it last year and bought the 96 truck that I mentioned and will be my last collector vehicle. I have been around cars and car repairs most all of my life but as they say, life (and old age) happens and I don’t have the energy or desire to work any more.
Right on,, that’s a lot of fun right there. I’m turning 60 in January and am really feeling it, and I’m in the middle of a huge project. It’s getting harder and harder, so I hear ya on the age issue.
Good that you have one in excellent condition.
Pugsy, I looked through the two links that you posted and I am impressed. You have done some very skilled work on that Chrysler. I’ve always been in awe of people who can shape metal like that. You have a good eye for design too, as I would never have even noticed that the roof would look better if lowered like that. Nice work on the El Camino too.
Thanks Russ.
It’s a labor of love…..or insanity. Another 5 years to go on the Chrysler minimum. Feels like it will never end, ha…
Troy, the point here is exactly the point you brought to the forefront! People, in general cannot or will not ever have enough money (at one time) to purchase a 50k or above muscle car from this time era. However, they do have a chance to purchase at a minimum cost one of these historical muscle cars, compared to the 50 or 70K mentioned above. Will they still have the same amount of money invested, as the new one, sure they will. However, the opportunity to restore as you go (or can afford to) provides you with that shot of one of these cars. That is practical and logical thinking, in the end you have what you wanted to begin with, a nice survivor from a by gone era!
Danny, I can see your point. Everyone wants what they cannot have. My question who are these people you mention? Not a kid in his 20’s barely making it on an entry level job. He won’t want a grandpa car. They have their own cars now.
Someone in their 30’s-40’s doubt it. Takes two people to work to afford the basics raise a family mortgage and two car payments. Pay seven thou for this? Junk up a two car garage with this rust bucket? What’s the wife going to say when her Jeep sits outside.
Guys I work with don’t have much left after a 50 hour a week with kids and sports. It’s a different time now. Rising everything who has 10 years to build this back which will never be done.. Which I ask you. What will a person have when they are done? Non original motor. All Chinese body panels. Even the GTO emblems are NOT GM anymore. It will never be right.
AMCFAN, thank you for the question! First, regarding the parts. You actually can purchase American made parts for a vast majority of these replacement parts, for these old muscle cars. I purchased recently, floors, quarters, and braces for my 68 Chevelle SS 138 car, and plan to do the same for my 70 Chevelle SS, all American made, not some cheap knock off from China. Did I pay more for American made? Sure did, and had no problem in doing so, for real American made muscle parts! Second who wants these car? The people who want these cars are the very same individuals and generations past, who want a piece of history, that can never be replicated every again. This market will always survive and thrive, regardless of what new vehicles hit mainstream society, especially looking at your battery operated car. This just pushes more people to have a tangible piece of what the real world was once,regarding automobiles. Last, regardless if it takes ten years Or 20 years, raise the family, they are the number one priority. But after the job is complete, return to the project, and finish the dream, never say what if or I remember when, I hear those every time when I pull into a gas station and spend an hour, answering questions about my 68. Take care.
And so the discussion has basically echoed what I said in the first place, and then was subsequently called an idiot. Here’s a photo of my 9th car since just 2012, which I bought for $3500 in running condition in August. My formula is to buy good cars in the first place, not rusty junk.
Since 2012 I’ve resurrected/restored….66 Renault Caravelle; 69 Volvo 1800; 76 MGB; ’60 Mercedes 190d; 75 BMW 2002; 65 Skylark; 63 Buick Riviera; 67 Chrysler Newport Custom; and now this nice ’65 New Yorker.
I can assure you all I am not a bottom feeder, and I DO know car restoration work. And, before someone calls me a flipper, I usually own/enjoy these cars for 2 or 3 years, then sell them on to the next owner. Usually I make my money back.
A while back there was a 57 Bel Aire barn find and someone right away said crush it because it was a four door and wouldn’t be worth restoring. That was the reason for my comment in this thread where I said “I always love reading the comments on here from people who are not car enthusiasts and have no idea about what it takes to restore a car.” I wasn’t aiming at anyone who normally posts here, just some whose first comment is always crush it, or it wouldn’t be worth the cost. This GTO convertible might be worth restoring to the original owner who might have deep pockets now and pleasant memories of it. It’s not always about the cash value when restored.
Rex, give it a break, point made! Myself, and others on this site get sick and tired of people jumping on here and wanting to scrap everything in sight, due to rust issues! Does rust exist? You bet it does, especially with 50 year old vehicles, why would you expect other wise? Geez, if you do not like rust, go and spend 50k on a new car, made of plastic, or battery operated, and stop expecting a nice shiny 70 Chevelle to take home.(let me guess, those same people would complain the car was to expensive at that point). Those are the talkers, not walkers who really work on these cars. Take care.
How much for the frame. I need one, my frame is bent.